Message to all our men and women in uniform: When encountering TERRORISTS using deadly force anywhere Shoot to Kill. STOP TAKING PRISONERS! Thank You!
AFP | Jan. 25, 2009
Two men released from the US “war on terror” prison at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba have appeared in a video posted on a jihadist website, the SITE monitoring service reported.
One of the two former inmates, a Saudi man identified as Abu Sufyan al-Azdi al-Shahri, or prisoner number 372, has been elevated to the senior ranks of Al-Qaeda in Yemen, a US counter-terrorism official told AFP.
Three other men appear in the video, including Abu al-Hareth Muhammad al-Oufi, identified as an Al-Qaeda field commander. SITE later said he was prisoner No. 333.
A Pentagon spokesman, Commander Jeffrey Gordon, on Saturday declined to confirm the SITE information.
“We remain concerned about ex-Guantanamo detainees who have re-affiliated with terrorist organizations after their departure,” said Gordon.
“We will continue to work with the international community to mitigate the threat they pose,” he said.
On the video, al-Shihri is seen sitting with three other men before a flag of the Islamic State of Iraq, the front for Al-Qaeda in Iraq.
“By Allah, imprisonment only increased our persistence in our principles for which we went out, did jihad for, and were imprisoned for,” al-Shihri was quoted as saying.
Al-Shiri was transferred from Guantanamo to Saudi Arabia in 2007, the US counter-terrorism official said.
The other men in the video are identified as Commander Abu Baseer al-Wahayshi and Abu Hureira Qasm al-Rimi (also known as Abu Hureira al-Sana’ani).
The Defense Department has said as many as 61 former Guantanamo detainees — about 11 percent of 520 detainees transferred from the detention center and released — are believed to have returned to the fight.
The latest case highlights the risk the new US administration faces as it moves to empty Guantanamo of its remaining 245 prisoners and close the controversial detention camp within a year.
. . . more
Are you saying that men who surrender should be summarily shot on the battlefield?
George, Terrorists do not fight on “battlefields” and are not “soldiers.” Have an issue with reading comprehension?
No. I read fine.
You said:
In Iraq, if American soldiers engage in a firefight with anti-American forces, if the fighters surrenders – are they to be shot?
What about Taliban in Afghanistan? Are they terrorists, and are they subject to summary execution?
When you call for the U.S. forces to shoot people dead who would otherwise be taken prisoner, how about defining what you are talking about? If someone would be in a position to be taken prisoner, but is instead killed, how is that legal or moral?
George, I’m sorry but you really are dense. You keep referring to “terrorists” as “Anti-American forces” as if they are a legitimate army. They are not! Rules of war do not (and cannot) apply when you are dealing with terrorists. Have you learned nothing these past few decades? Obviously not.
FYI, the Geneva Convention does not apply to terrorists.
Perhaps I am dense. Perhaps then you can enlighten me, because obviously I can’t reach the subtle levels of your mind.
You are telling American forces to not take prisoners. American forces are engaged in two major fronts currently. Iraq, which has a SOFA in place now, and Afghanistan.
Are you advocating that U.S. soldiers should engage in summary execution of fighters taken in combat in Iraq and Afghanistan? Is that what you mean by, not taking prisoners?
Forget the rules of war, how about you apply just Christian ethics as a measure of this.
How about simple Christian ethics? Does that apply?
What part of “When encountering TERRORISTS using deadly force anywhere Shoot to Kill.” you don’t understand? That means that terrorists using deadly force should be exterminated in place unless there is an intelligence aspect that may help save innocent lives. The taking of prisoners aspect should be left to the discretion of the soldiers and their commanders on the ground, with the understanding that TERRORISTS are not soldiers and the Geneva Convention does NOT apply to terrorists, by its very definition and specific wording. Please do read it!
Next time your family is in imminent danger from a suicide bomber or a terrorist takes over the plane you’re on go ahead and use Christian ethics to defend yourself and those innocents around you. Let me know how well that works… Christ calls us to be loving and forgiving, not delusional and defensless against active and unrepentant evil.
As the editor of a blog that purports to be Orthodox Christian, you are saying, if I get this straight, that American soldiers should be free to summarily execute individuals taken in military engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan. Taking individual prisoner is optional.
No mercy. No quarter.
I am not asking U.S. Marines or soldiers to shoot anywhere else than center mass. That is where I was trained to shoot, and that is perfectly acceptable.
But if an individual is wounded or has surrendered, can they be executed on the spot at the discretion of their commanders?
No one said to do so. If the terrorist on the plane is overpowerd, however, and surrenders, am I supposed to shoot him at my own discretion?
Sorry George, you’ll never understand this unless you experience Islam, Muslims and terrorist by yourself. These guys are not freedom fighters, soldiers or even human by any measurements. They are evil, taught by evil (Koran) and drink hate to infidel (that is you my dear brother in Christ) and if they have any slim chance to kill you and your, they wouldn’t hesitate for a moment because they are doing their god a service, and they will be rewarded with virgins in heaven.
Now, with this evil mentality, if we have mercy compassion and love, we WILL be dead before analyzing the situation as a good American or Christian people.
Finally, I agree with editor 110%, because I have tasted terrorism at it’s prime in my country with my family and friends. YOU CANNOT SIGN AN AGREEMENT WITH THEM and you cannot trust them for a minute, because if you do .. you’re dead. They ARE NOT HUMAN!
Oh, one more thing
Our Christianity taught us to be a Lamb when I’m attacked BUT A LION when someone else is attacked. In another words, Lamb in self defense, a Lion to defend others, church and believers.
Finally,
Once a good man said “Those people (Muslim terrorist) want to meet their god and all we do is expedite their process”
And that is right because they will never rest or quit until then ….
While the actions of jihadis is inhuman, even demonic, the people themselves are human. To say otherwise is a denial that Christ died for all of us in the midst of our sin, degradation and evil.
Certainly Christianity is not a pacifist faith but war is still problematic for Christians since the intentional killing of another human being is a sin. Chrisitan principals demand that all reasonable avenues to peace be seriously attempted and we be in immediate danger before resorting to any act of war. Jesus tells us to live lives of peace, forgiveness and kenotic service to others, i.e, love our enemies.
The question each of us faces is how to do that? There are no easy or formulaic answers. There will continue to be debates on the circumstances and conditions under which Christians can and should use deadly force. Clearly, however, deadly force is not prohibited to us. What are we defending? What is the nature and extent of the threat? What means for defense is at our disposal and which ones should be use? How do we as a country and as individuals conduct war in a righteous manner. There are many Christian commentators who suggest that there are no general answers, only specific ones.
Is it possible to love our enemies and still kill them? That depends on how the word enemy is defined. Is our enemy the country or ideology in a general sense or simply the person in front of us trying to kill us? Keep in mind that love in a Christian sense is not the emotion and hormones and almost psychotic state of euphoria associated with ‘falling in love’. It is putting the needs of others ahead of our own with as much dispassion as we can muster. At the very least we can fight our enemy without falling into the trap of the passions, passions that demand we hate and dehumanize our enemy, nor should we rejoice in their deaths. No easy task, but possible even in the midst of warfare. Without a clear understanding of what and who the enemy is, such questions become much more difficult to answer. Our current leadership seems determined to make it even more foggy than before.
Summary execution of helpless combatants, criminals and soldiers has never been the policy of the U.S. military or police forces. Nor should it be. That is one thing that sets us aside from our enemies. However, it should be the policy to detain those who fight against us for the duration of the war, conflict, or whatever it is called. If that is not being done, as it is not, it should not be surprising that our soldiers will tend to take a more aggressive stance against anyone who confronts them, liberalizing the rules of engagement, even exceeding them with greater frequency. Killing as the editor suggests. Not a good thing.
The Church needs to be prepared to tend to the physical, emotional and spiritual wounds of those our country sends into battle. We have all the tools, we must use them and take whatever action we can to see that those outside the Church receive similar care.
this is shocking to see two ex-guantanamo inmates re-join al qaeda. usg needed to rehabilitate these muslims’ akidah by means of pro western islamic groups (excluding cair of course) which champion secularism, democracy, and human rights.
This is how intelligent and reasonable people living in the real world and concerned with defending innocence deal with this problem:
America as the last man standing
‘In a generation or two, the US will ask itself: who lost Europe?’
Here is the speech of Geert Wilders, Chairman, Party for Freedom, the Netherlands, at the Four Seasons, New York, introducing an Alliance of Patriots and announcing the Facing Jihad Conference in Jerusalem.
The speech was sponsored by the Hudson Institute on September 25.
Dear friends,
Thank you very much for inviting me.
I come to America with a mission. All is not well in the old world. There is a tremendous danger looming, and it is very difficult to be optimistic. We might be in the final stages of the Islamization of Europe. This not only is a clear and present danger to the future of Europe itself, it is a threat to America and the sheer survival of the West. The United States as the last bastion of Western civilization, facing an Islamic Europe.
First I will describe the situation on the ground in Europe. Then, I will say a few things about Islam. To close I will tell you about a meeting in Jerusalem.
The Europe you know is changing. You have probably seen the landmarks. But in all of these cities, sometimes a few blocks away from your tourist destination, there is another world. It is the world of the parallel society created by Muslim mass-migration. All throughout Europe a new reality is rising: entire Muslim neighborhoods where very few indigenous people reside or are even seen. And if they are, they might regret it. This goes for the police as well. It’s the world of head scarves, where women walk around in figureless tents, with baby strollers and a group of children. Their husbands, or slaveholders if you prefer, walk three steps ahead. With mosques on many street corners. The shops have signs you and I cannot read. You will be hard-pressed to find any economic activity. These are Muslim ghettos controlled by religious fanatics. These are Muslim neighborhoods, and they are mushrooming in every city across Europe. These are the building-blocks for territorial control of increasingly larger portions of Europe, street by street, neighborhood by neighborhood, city by city.
There are now thousands of mosques throughout Europe. With larger congregations than there are in churches. And in every European city there are plans to build super-mosques that will dwarf every church in the region. Clearly, the signal is: we rule.
Many European cities are already one-quarter Muslim: just take Amsterdam, Marseille and Malmo in Sweden. In many cities the majority of the under-18 population is Muslim. Paris is now surrounded by a ring of Muslim neighborhoods. Mohammed is the most popular name among boys in many cities. In some elementary schools in Amsterdam the farm can no longer be mentioned, because that would also mean mentioning the pig, and that would be an insult to Muslims. Many state schools in Belgium and Denmark only serve halal food to all pupils. In once-tolerant Amsterdam gays are beaten up almost exclusively by Muslims. Non-Muslim women routinely hear ‘whore, whore’. Satellite dishes are not pointed to local TV stations, but to stations in the country of origin. In France school teachers are advised to avoid authors deemed offensive to Muslims, including Voltaire and Diderot; the same is increasingly true of Darwin. The history of the Holocaust can no longer be taught because of Muslim sensitivity. In England sharia courts are now officially part of the British legal system.. Many neighborhoods in France are no-go areas for women without head scarves. Last week a man almost died after being beaten up by Muslims in Brussels, because he was drinking during the Ramadan. Jews are fleeing France in record numbers, on the run for the worst wave of anti-Semitism since World War II. French is now commonly spoken on the streets of Tel Aviv and Netanya, Israel. I could go on forever with stories like this. Stories about Islamization.
A total of fifty-four million Muslims now live in Europe. San Diego University recently calculated that a staggering 25 percent of the population in Europe will be Muslim just 12 years from now. Bernhard Lewis has predicted a Muslim majority by the end of this century.
Now these are just numbers. And the numbers would not be threatening if the Muslim-immigrants had a strong desire to assimilate. But there are few signs of that. The Pew Research Center reported that half of French Muslims see their loyalty to Islam as greater than their loyalty to France. One-third of French Muslims do not object to suicide attacks. The British Centre for Social Cohesion reported that one-third of British Muslim students are in favor of a worldwide caliphate. Muslims demand what they call ‘respect’. And this is how we give them respect. We have Muslim official state holidays.
The Christian-Democratic attorney general is willing to accept sharia in the Netherlands if there is a Muslim majority. We have cabinet members with passports from Morocco and Turkey.
Muslim demands are supported by unlawful behavior, ranging from petty crimes and random violence, for example against ambulance workers and bus drivers, to small-scale riots. Paris has seen its uprising in the low-income suburbs, the banlieus. I call the perpetrators ‘settlers’. Because that is what they are. They do not come to integrate into our societies, they come to integrate our society into their Dar-al-Islam. Therefore, they are settlers.
Much of this street violence I mentioned is directed exclusively against non-Muslims, forcing many native people to leave their neighborhoods, their cities, their countries. Moreover, Muslims are now a swing vote not to be ignored. ,.
The second thing you need to know is the importance of Mohammed the prophet. His behavior is an example to all Muslims and cannot be criticized. Now, if Mohammed had been a man of peace, let us say like Ghandi and Mother Theresa wrapped in one, there would be no problem. But Mohammed was a warlord, a mass murderer, a pedophile, and had several marriages – at the same time. Islamic tradition tells us how he fought in battles, how he had his enemies murdered and even had prisoners of war executed. Mohammed himself slaughtered the Jewish tribe of Banu Qurayza. If it is good for Islam, it is good. If it is bad for Islam, it is bad.
Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means ‘submission’. Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.
Now you know why Winston Churchill called Islam ‘the most retrograde force in the world’, and why he compared Mein Kampf to the Quran. The public has wholeheartedly accepted the Palestinian narrative, and sees Israel as the aggressor. I have lived in this country and visited it dozens of times. I support Israel. First, because it is the Jewish homeland after two thousand years of exile up to and including Auschwitz, second because it is a democracy, and third because Israel is our first line of defense.
This tiny country is situated on the fault line of jihad, frustrating Islam’s territorial advance. Israel is facing the front lines of jihad, like Kashmir, Kosovo, the Philippines, Southern Thailand, Darfur in Sudan, Lebanon, and Aceh in Indonesia. Israel is simply in the way. The same way West-Berlin was during the Cold War.
The war against Israel is not a war against Israel. It is a war against the West. It is jihad. Israel is simply receiving the blows that are meant for all of us. If there would have been no Israel, Islamic imperialism would have found other venues to release its energy and its desire for conquest. Thanks to Israeli parents who send their children to the army and lay awake at night, parents in Europe and America can sleep well and dream, unaware of the dangers looming.
Many in Europe argue in favor of abandoning Israel in order to address the grievances of our Muslim minorities. But if Israel were, God forbid, to go down, it would not bring any solace to the West. It would not mean our Muslim minorities would all of a sudden change their behavior, and accept our values. On the contrary, the end of Israel would give enormous encouragement to the forces of Islam. They would, and rightly so, see the demise of Israel as proof that the West is weak, and doomed. The end of Israel would not mean the end of our problems with Islam, but only the beginning. It would mean the start of the final battle for world domination. If they can get Israel, they can get everything. So-called journalists volunteer to label any and all critics of Islamization as a ‘right-wing extremists’ or ‘racists’. In my country, the Netherlands, 60 percent of the population now sees the mass immigration of Muslims as the number one policy mistake since World War II. And another 60 percent sees Islam as the biggest threat. Yet there is a danger greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a loss of military might for America – as its allies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome, Athens and Jerusalem.
Dear friends, liberty is the most precious of gifts. My generation never had to fight for this freedom, it was offered to us on a silver platter, by people who fought for it with their lives. All throughout Europe American cemeteries remind us of the young boys who never made it home, and whose memory we cherish. My generation does not own this freedom; we are merely its custodians. We can only hand over this hard won liberty to Europe’s children in the same state in which it was offered to us. We cannot strike a deal with mullahs and imams. Future generations would never forgive us. We cannot squander our liberties. We simply do not have the right to do so.
America as the last man standing
‘In a generation or two, the US will ask itself: who lost Europe?’
Here is the speech of Geert Wilders, Chairman, Party for Freedom, the Netherlands, at the Four Seasons, New York, introducing an Alliance of Patriots and announcing the Facing Jihad Conference in Jerusalem.
The speech was sponsored by the Hudson Institute on September 25.
Dear friends,
Thank you very much for inviting me.
I come to America with a mission. All is not well in the old world. There is a tremendous danger looming, and it is very difficult to be optimistic. We might be in the final stages of the Islamization of Europe. This not only is a clear and present danger to the future of Europe itself, it is a threat to America and the sheer survival of the West. The United States as the last bastion of Western civilization, facing an Islamic Europe.
First I will describe the situation on the ground in Europe. Then, I will say a few things about Islam. To close I will tell you about a meeting in Jerusalem.
The Europe you know is changing. You have probably seen the landmarks. But in all of these cities, sometimes a few blocks away from your tourist destination, there is another world. It is the world of the parallel society created by Muslim mass-migration. All throughout Europe a new reality is rising: entire Muslim neighborhoods where very few indigenous people reside or are even seen. And if they are, they might regret it. This goes for the police as well. It’s the world of head scarves, where women walk around in figureless tents, with baby strollers and a group of children. Their husbands, or slaveholders if you prefer, walk three steps ahead. With mosques on many street corners. The shops have signs you and I cannot read. You will be hard-pressed to find any economic activity. These are Muslim ghettos controlled by religious fanatics. These are Muslim neighborhoods, and they are mushrooming in every city across Europe. These are the building-blocks for territorial control of increasingly larger portions of Europe, street by street, neighborhood by neighborhood, city by city.
There are now thousands of mosques throughout Europe. With larger congregations than there are in churches. And in every European city there are plans to build super-mosques that will dwarf every church in the region. Clearly, the signal is: we rule.
Many European cities are already one-quarter Muslim: just take Amsterdam, Marseille and Malmo in Sweden. In many cities the majority of the under-18 population is Muslim. Paris is now surrounded by a ring of Muslim neighborhoods. Mohammed is the most popular name among boys in many cities. In some elementary schools in Amsterdam the farm can no longer be mentioned, because that would also mean mentioning the pig, and that would be an insult to Muslims. Many state schools in Belgium and Denmark only serve halal food to all pupils. In once-tolerant Amsterdam gays are beaten up almost exclusively by Muslims. Non-Muslim women routinely hear ‘whore, whore’. Satellite dishes are not pointed to local TV stations, but to stations in the country of origin. In France school teachers are advised to avoid authors deemed offensive to Muslims, including Voltaire and Diderot; the same is increasingly true of Darwin. The history of the Holocaust can no longer be taught because of Muslim sensitivity. In England sharia courts are now officially part of the British legal system.. Many neighborhoods in France are no-go areas for women without head scarves. Last week a man almost died after being beaten up by Muslims in Brussels, because he was drinking during the Ramadan. Jews are fleeing France in record numbers, on the run for the worst wave of anti-Semitism since World War II. French is now commonly spoken on the streets of Tel Aviv and Netanya, Israel. I could go on forever with stories like this. Stories about Islamization.
A total of fifty-four million Muslims now live in Europe. San Diego University recently calculated that a staggering 25 percent of the population in Europe will be Muslim just 12 years from now. Bernhard Lewis has predicted a Muslim majority by the end of this century.
Now these are just numbers. And the numbers would not be threatening if the Muslim-immigrants had a strong desire to assimilate. But there are few signs of that. The Pew Research Center reported that half of French Muslims see their loyalty to Islam as greater than their loyalty to France. One-third of French Muslims do not object to suicide attacks. The British Centre for Social Cohesion reported that one-third of British Muslim students are in favor of a worldwide caliphate. Muslims demand what they call ‘respect’. And this is how we give them respect. We have Muslim official state holidays.
The Christian-Democratic attorney general is willing to accept sharia in the Netherlands if there is a Muslim majority. We have cabinet members with passports from Morocco and Turkey.
Muslim demands are supported by unlawful behavior, ranging from petty crimes and random violence, for example against ambulance workers and bus drivers, to small-scale riots. Paris has seen its uprising in the low-income suburbs, the banlieus. I call the perpetrators ‘settlers’. Because that is what they are. They do not come to integrate into our societies, they come to integrate our society into their Dar-al-Islam. Therefore, they are settlers.
Much of this street violence I mentioned is directed exclusively against non-Muslims, forcing many native people to leave their neighborhoods, their cities, their countries. Moreover, Muslims are now a swing vote not to be ignored. ,.
The second thing you need to know is the importance of Mohammed the prophet. His behavior is an example to all Muslims and cannot be criticized. Now, if Mohammed had been a man of peace, let us say like Ghandi and Mother Theresa wrapped in one, there would be no problem. But Mohammed was a warlord, a mass murderer, a pedophile, and had several marriages – at the same time. Islamic tradition tells us how he fought in battles, how he had his enemies murdered and even had prisoners of war executed. Mohammed himself slaughtered the Jewish tribe of Banu Qurayza. If it is good for Islam, it is good. If it is bad for Islam, it is bad.
Let no one fool you about Islam being a religion. Sure, it has a god, and a here-after, and 72 virgins. But in its essence Islam is a political ideology. It is a system that lays down detailed rules for society and the life of every person. Islam wants to dictate every aspect of life. Islam means ‘submission’. Islam is not compatible with freedom and democracy, because what it strives for is sharia. If you want to compare Islam to anything, compare it to communism or national-socialism, these are all totalitarian ideologies.
Now you know why Winston Churchill called Islam ‘the most retrograde force in the world’, and why he compared Mein Kampf to the Quran. The public has wholeheartedly accepted the Palestinian narrative, and sees Israel as the aggressor. I have lived in this country and visited it dozens of times. I support Israel. First, because it is the Jewish homeland after two thousand years of exile up to and including Auschwitz, second because it is a democracy, and third because Israel is our first line of defense.
This tiny country is situated on the fault line of jihad, frustrating Islam’s territorial advance. Israel is facing the front lines of jihad, like Kashmir, Kosovo, the Philippines, Southern Thailand, Darfur in Sudan, Lebanon, and Aceh in Indonesia. Israel is simply in the way. The same way West-Berlin was during the Cold War.
The war against Israel is not a war against Israel. It is a war against the West. It is jihad. Israel is simply receiving the blows that are meant for all of us. If there would have been no Israel, Islamic imperialism would have found other venues to release its energy and its desire for conquest. Thanks to Israeli parents who send their children to the army and lay awake at night, parents in Europe and America can sleep well and dream, unaware of the dangers looming.
Many in Europe argue in favor of abandoning Israel in order to address the grievances of our Muslim minorities. But if Israel were, God forbid, to go down, it would not bring any solace to the West. It would not mean our Muslim minorities would all of a sudden change their behavior, and accept our values. On the contrary, the end of Israel would give enormous encouragement to the forces of Islam. They would, and rightly so, see the demise of Israel as proof that the West is weak, and doomed. The end of Israel would not mean the end of our problems with Islam, but only the beginning. It would mean the start of the final battle for world domination. If they can get Israel, they can get everything. So-called journalists volunteer to label any and all critics of Islamization as a ‘right-wing extremists’ or ‘racists’. In my country, the Netherlands, 60 percent of the population now sees the mass immigration of Muslims as the number one policy mistake since World War II. And another 60 percent sees Islam as the biggest threat. Yet there is a danger greater danger than terrorist attacks, the scenario of America as the last man standing. The lights may go out in Europe faster than you can imagine. An Islamic Europe means a Europe without freedom and democracy, an economic wasteland, an intellectual nightmare, and a loss of military might for America – as its allies will turn into enemies, enemies with atomic bombs. With an Islamic Europe, it would be up to America alone to preserve the heritage of Rome, Athens and Jerusalem.
Dear friends, liberty is the most precious of gifts. My generation never had to fight for this freedom, it was offered to us on a silver platter, by people who fought for it with their lives. All throughout Europe American cemeteries remind us of the young boys who never made it home, and whose memory we cherish. My generation does not own this freedom; we are merely its custodians. We can only hand over this hard won liberty to Europe’s children in the same state in which it was offered to us. We cannot strike a deal with mullahs and imams. Future generations would never forgive us. We cannot squander our liberties. We simply do not have the right to do so.
All true. Which makes a few questions necessary.
Why are we spending billions on trying to build Democracy in Iraq and Afghanistan, while continuing to allow Muslim immigration to the United States at a higher rate than pre-9/11? Isn’t the money wasted and the high immigration and mosque building only leading to the same situation as in Europe?
Why is the American elite of both parties such supporters of Turkey, inclusion of Turkey in the NATO, and of increased Muslim immigration that would attend that move?
We are spending borrowed money on fighting two wars whose primary purpose, creating peaceful, secular, Muslim states this rather lengthy peace declares impossible.
Did you get that? If you believe what this guy is saying, then billions poured into Iraq and Afghanistan to build showcase democracies is a total waste of lives and money.
There is no Jihad worthy of the name. The Muslim world can’t take even a minor European nation in a fair fight. Since Vienna, any Western army with half a will to fight can crush any Muslim army in the field.
This is about immigration. The new front in the Jihad isn’t terrorism, it isn’t nukes, it’s immigration. That is what is drowning Europe, and could take us down also. Military defeat? Not possible. But being bled to death while our economy stagnates? That is a real possibility.
By the way – what did Cheney do about the threat to Europe? Nothing. Of course, nothing. Because Islam is a religion of peace – he and Bush said so. Which is why they ramped up the Muslim refugee settlement business after 9/11 and helped give the world a new Muslim state.
The Bush/Cheney administration was a fiasco. Time to get rid of these policies, and then move on. Mass slaughter is not the answer. There were fewer head scarves and burqas in the Middle East 30 years ago than today. We lost ground. Right as the Muslim world was starting to turn from Islam, we showed up with our checkbooks to back the Mujahadin, to allow Saudis to bankroll Islamic centers in Europe, and the Israelis were stupid enough to found Hamas to provide an ‘Islamic’ alternative to commie-leaning Fatah.
Time to get over all that, and focus on policies that actually work. Policies centered around conversion from Islam.
George, it is exactly that kind of thinking – yours, not to put too fine a point on it – that has landed Europe in the predicament it is in. For you to think that any small European country could rise up and take a muslim army in a fair fight is flawed. Firstly because most European governments are overrun with politically correct Liberals with blinders on and are easily intimidated by these Muslim thugs. Secondly because the Islamists don’t fight fair. They don’t care how gruesome or sub-human their tactics are – no Western power has the will to pound them into total submission (because the action required they don’t have the stomach for) – which is the only thing that will quell the spread of this viscious cancer. We’re too worried about prosecuting George W. for “waterboarding torture”, closing Club Gitmo, and basically undoing all of the security measures his administration built up over the last 8 years. You also trivialize this threat by saying that there were “fewer head scarves and burkas in the Middle East 30 years ago than today”, as if to say that the West is getting its just reward for interfering. Right or wrong, we can’t undo what has been done and we must awaken to see this threat for what it really is REGARDLESS OF WHO WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR CREATING IT!!!!! Make no mistake, if everybody keeps on saying (W. included) that Islam is a religion of peace, and we should learn to understand it, then one day we will all awaken under the oppressive thumb of sharia law and be forced to pray 5 times a day, prohibited from any form of art and media and women will be hidden away or married off at puberty and then be forced to wither away behind the burkah.
Chambelain tried to placate the Nazis and look where it got England and the rest of Europe.
So George, yes you are right that no Muslim army could defeat the west in a stand-up fight, but they don’t have to: they can just infiltrate and hide under the protection of laws meant to engender liberty while destroying Western Civilization from within.
George, let me amend my previous response to your post: when I said that your kind of thinking led to Europe being in the predicament they’re in, I should’ve been more specific. I didn’t mean to generalize about the entirety of your thoughts about this subject. That comment was really directed at your closing comment “Time to get over all that, and focus on policies that actually work. Policies centered around conversion from Islam”.
The truth is, I’m not sure there is any policy that can accomplish that, given the sheer numbers that they have built up in Europe. The majority of these people swear no allegiance to their host countries, nor do they consider themselves subject to their laws, yet the harass their host countries’ governments to adapt to their sensibilities (i.e. improper mentioning of their prophet Mohammad, serving pork in public schools, and a host of other demands).
I don’t know about you but I, like many others I would presume, have fantasized about an “age of enlightenment” sweeping through the muslim world in which fairness and human rights would rule the day, however there are many problems with fantasy (besides the fact that it’ll never happen) – not the least of which being that the number of martyrs for that cause that would pile up would make the persecutions suffered by christians at the hands of certain Roman emporers and the Jewish holocaust combined seem like a schoolyard dust-up. These bloodthirsty subhumans would relish the idea of a genocide (Kosovo, Darfur), and they’re willing to bide their time and wait till the time is right. I’m sure they dream about it every night with regard to Israel.
Then you push them out, and keep others from coming in. The European continent has produced nationalist movements, which the United States is quick to condemn. If you are an Austrian or German nationalist that would like to rid your country of the Muslim 5th Column, then you are going to find yourself branded by the US government as hate mongering, or crypto-fascist.
We can not control the Europeans. What we have to get control of is our own government. Again, you keep mixing things up. The primary threat to Europe is a lack of nationalist sentiment that allows Muslims to sweep into a vacuum and establish effective control. The forces that are springing up to oppose this move are treated by our political establishment (“left” and “right”) as enemies. That we can control.
This is the central Jihad. Terrorism is not. The U.S. has done zippo to focus on the real threat, social transformation from within, while spending billions of dollars borrowed from China to chase down desert rats.
You are so right. I saw an interview on Hannity tonight and this guy has documented evidence there are 32 training camps in the USA right now training terrorists and our government isnt doing didilly squat to stop it. Of course they are being run by some Islamic organization.